At Last!. I have started on my car ;-) PART 2

[old-git]

Front and rear anti roll bars have been ordered - approx 3 week turnround.

As discussed in a separate thread, I have been looking to modify the upper front wishbones. Although they are adjustable, this can only be done by removing them from the car which will be a pain. I have therefore been looking at ways of modifying them so they can be adjusted insitu.

Having looked into one way that was going to cost around £400 I have decided to use a female rod end and a left/right hand threaded bar. However, finding a bar has proved difficult so they haver got to be made. Although T9 has very kindly offered to talk to a friend's friend I have decided to make them myself. To that end I have ordered a left hand thread 1/2" UNF die (I have a right hand die) and a length of 1/" round bar in EN8.

The top wishbone shows the existing setup. The bottom one shows a female rod end (just ordered them so this one is from my steering rack that has the fixing bolt built in - no good for the wishbone) The double threaded bar will join the two, allowing adjustment on the car. The rod ends will have to be shortened to allow locking nuts to be added plus some room for adjustment.

http://www.torquecars.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=1654&stc=1&d=1335979683

 

[old-git]

Did a few jobs this weekend:

Fitted diff for the last time (hopefully)

http://www.torquecars.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=1656&stc=1&d=1336415720

Completed proof of concept front top wishbone modification. A bonus of this mod is a a total weight reduction of 0.26Kg

http://www.torquecars.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=1657&stc=1&d=1336415842

Made spacers to compensate for difference in width of original rubber bush and new rod end:

http://www.torquecars.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=1658&stc=1&d=1336415926

 

[old-git]

Made my first fuel pipe today. Cutting braided pipe is a bugger. Tried cutting with a fine toothed hacksaw blade, as recommended by the hose fitting manufacturer, but this ended up a sharp, spiky mess, even when cutting area taped up tight. Finally got a good cut using an angle grinder and fine cutting disc.

Can't make any more pipes until tank and system fitted into boot, but at least it is a start and I now know that I can make them.

http://www.torquecars.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=1666&stc=1&d=1337100940

 

[T9 man]

I tried the fine toothed junior hacksaw route too OG and it was pants. I used a quality pair of tin snips in the end and they were much better.

 

[davalav]

OG I have to see this project in the flesh. I cannot believe I have only just seen this!

It's incredeble my friend, and I cannot wait to see it in action! I have a question...

If it's for drag races and hill climbs, wouldn't AWD be a better bet, as you can get more traction and presumably better cornering for the climbs? I know weight is a must, but its food for thought!

 

[old-git]

I have certainly considered 4WD but, after considering the weight, cost and work involved, decided against it. Also, being a died-in-the-wool RWD man it seems to be cheating .

The Elan handles superbly. Adding power to the front wheels will upset the geometry, possibly to its detriment.

Having said that, if I find that I am unable to use all the power available it is still an option I would be prepared to consider.

 

[davalav]

I have certainly considered 4WD but, after considering the weight, cost and work involved, decided against it. Also, being a died-in-the-wool RWD man it seems to be cheating .

The Elan handles superbly. Adding power to the front wheels will upset the geometry, possibly to its detriment.

Having said that, if I find that I am unable to use all the power available it is still an option I would be prepared to consider.

I didn't think of geometry... Excuse me, but I am not glued up about that at all. :embarrest:

If it's low enough, surely it shouldn't effect it too much? But cost is always a limiting factor. Regardless, I cant wait to see this on the road/ track!

 

[old-git]

Other awkward issues are that the main front chassis crossmember is where the driveshafts would be and the engine sits behind the front wheels.

 

[Customcreations]

Made my first fuel pipe today. Cutting braided pipe is a bugger. Tried cutting with a fine toothed hacksaw blade, as recommended by the hose fitting manufacturer, but this ended up a sharp, spiky mess, even when cutting area taped up tight. Finally got a good cut using an angle grinder and fine cutting disc.

Can't make any more pipes until tank and system fitted into boot, but at least it is a start and I now know that I can make them.

http://www.torquecars.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=1666&stc=1&d=1337100940

Well I just sat down for the last couple of hours reading this thread from the start. I have to refrain from catching this car dieting bug. It's definately the go though. REALLY enjoyed the read.

Makes me keen to get back into my Mitsubishi Triton 4X4 with buick 3800 V6 Mod project.

In regards to your braided fuel line cutting.
I find it funny, the idea's that the people selling this stuff have (supposed pro's) telling you to use a fine bladed hacksaw. In the past I have installed stainless cables for hand rail systems used on industrial sites.
There I used what was equivelent to a set of pruning shears but miniaturized for the hard stainless cable. I would recomend trying pruning shears for your braided fuel hosing. It would work a treat. Less chance of filings from a hack saw or cutting disk and quick cut too.

 

[old-git]

Well I just sat down for the last couple of hours reading this thread from the start. I have to refrain from catching this car dieting bug. It's definately the go though. REALLY enjoyed the read.

Makes me keen to get back into my Mitsubishi Triton 4X4 with buick 3800 V6 Mod project.

In regards to your braided fuel line cutting.
I find it funny, the idea's that the people selling this stuff have (supposed pro's) telling you to use a fine bladed hacksaw. In the past I have installed stainless cables for hand rail systems used on industrial sites.
There I used what was equivelent to a set of pruning shears but miniaturized for the hard stainless cable. I would recomend trying pruning shears for your braided fuel hosing. It would work a treat. Less chance of filings from a hack saw or cutting disk and quick cut too.

Thanks, I will give that a go when the wife isn't looking

 

[Loz]

S'good point that, The gear cable cutters I use on my road bike are just really tiny pruning shears.

 

[old-git]

Why, oh why, don't I listen to my own advice?

Try as I might, I was unable to cut the thread straight, so the bolt wobbled when wound in. Gave up and took new bolts and die to my tame engineering firm. They had similar problems and it turned out to be the cheapo die I bought on ebay for £8! They have now ordered a decent die - £25 - which should have arrived today so, hopefully, I will get my bolts tomorrow.

Buy cheap and buy twice, never a truer word spoken

 

[Customcreations]

At least this thread isn't wobbly like the die you bought.
I was thinking on doing a thread on my 4X4 triton conversion but that would be lame in comparison to this masterpeice. I wish we would have some more sport car options in Australia. (instead of the usual HOLDEN, TOYOTA, MAZDA, NISSAN, SUBARU, FORD etc).
I remember owning a Matra Bagera( may have the spelling wrong) when I was living in Holland/Netherlands It was only a dinky toy but was fun to drive.
Until I did a side slide on ICE and hit a fence post. Was only going slow but the post was solid as, so passenger door got smashed and the Sil panel.
That was a bad year as I went to go and get a door for it and TOTALLED my Step Dad's car. The only accident I ever had with another car involved. (SO FAR )
Did you try the wife's pruning shears.
If you do it would most likely go without saying but I can't help myself
Make sure your wifes shears are in good nick and not loose.
Before and AFTER

 

[MasterAuron]

You're crazy OG.

I love it!

 

[Loz]

Why, oh why, don't I listen to my own advice?

Try as I might, I was unable to cut the thread straight, so the bolt wobbled when wound in. Gave up and took new bolts and die to my tame engineering firm. They had similar problems and it turned out to be the cheapo die I bought on ebay for £8! They have now ordered a decent die - £25 - which should have arrived today so, hopefully, I will get my bolts tomorrow.

Buy cheap and buy twice, never a truer word spoken

Ahmen to that brother. :amuse:

 

[old-git]

You're crazy OG.

And your point is?

 

[old-git]

At least this thread isn't wobbly like the die you bought.
I was thinking on doing a thread on my 4X4 triton conversion but that would be lame in comparison to this masterpeice. I wish we would have some more sport car options in Australia. (instead of the usual HOLDEN, TOYOTA, MAZDA, NISSAN, SUBARU, FORD etc).
I remember owning a Matra Bagera( may have the spelling wrong) when I was living in Holland/Netherlands It was only a dinky toy but was fun to drive.
Until I did a side slide on ICE and hit a fence post. Was only going slow but the post was solid as, so passenger door got smashed and the Sil panel.
That was a bad year as I went to go and get a door for it and TOTALLED my Step Dad's car. The only accident I ever had with another car involved. (SO FAR )
Did you try the wife's pruning shears.
If you do it would most likely go without saying but I can't help myself
Make sure your wifes shears are in good nick and not loose.
Before and AFTER

What's a Triton? Over here it's a mix of Triumph and Norton motor cycles.

Have you thought of importing the car of your dreams?

Not a good day, but any crash you can walk away from aint so bad.

Not yet, but I tried my 4 foot Guillotine and that only managed to make a mess.

 

[old-git]

Picke dup bolts and rear hubs this afternoon.

Hubs are 126grams lighter each, so just over a quarterof a kilo removed from rotating mass.

Total removed from rear suspension and drivetrain 5.2kg.

Bolts are good, except they have left too much land between the two threads. Hopefully I can rectify this tomorrow now that I have a decent die.

http://www.torquecars.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=1671&stc=1&d=1337382720

http://www.torquecars.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=1670&stc=1&d=1337382720

 

[Customcreations]

What's a Triton? Over here it's a mix of Triumph and Norton motor cycles.

Have you thought of importing the car of your dreams?

Not a good day, but any crash you can walk away from aint so bad.

Not yet, but I tried my 4 foot Guillotine and that only managed to make a mess.

A Mitsibishi Triton 92 model. Was Originally a 2.6 4g63 4cyl. 4WD. Ute.
Engine changed to a VN Commodore (Buick 3800 Series 1 V6)
I'll take a PIC but you may want to barf at the monstrosity of it plus it having been in the weather for about 4 yrs. Just looks sad but I have finished rebuilding and improving the LSD rear diff. Gearbox is rebuilt and ready to put back in. Just need to finish the porting on the heads then the rebuild to the engine is complete too. Really have to get it going again.
I think they were rather drunk when they come up with the name for the TRITON. Very genuine and logical I guess as the car weighs in at about 2.74ton Yes thats 2.74 ton. AS in 2740kg.
Hence TRI TON

I would import a car but for the fact I have 0 funds to do that.
Luckily before I got crook I had already forked out for all the parts for the TRITON rebuild so now it's just a matter of rebuilding it/ refitting the parts. Also glad I can do all my own work and save a bucket load on labour. I rebuild all my own engines, gearboxes etc. That's pretty much my hobby. Working out how to do stuff myself! Plus I come from a family of car nuts.

So how far are you away from a finished project now?
Not that something like your project is ever really finished.
There's always more improvements and tweaks to get it how you like it.

 

[old-git]

One of these CC?

http://www.torquecars.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=1672&stc=1&d=1337441269

What have you done to yourself? Was it a result of the last crash?

Making stuff, especially stuff you can't buy, is both fun, cheap and satisfying.

 

[old-git]

Some design changes on the hoof required because of the tight space. Having both locking nuts in the middle allowed for very little movement, so by a little bit of grinding of the back of the threaded part of the wishbone and machining a nut as shown, I now have, I hope, sufficient adjustment. The threaded bar is now adjusted using the slot cut in the end. Just need to get the OK from my chassis guru before making the other 3.

http://www.torquecars.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=1673&stc=1&d=1337442847

 

[Customcreations]

One of these CC?

http://www.torquecars.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=1672&stc=1&d=1337441269


Thats the model car. When it was still going it would do donuts
on the dry TAR in the dry weather. With the 33" mud tyres on it too.
I t was fun to bash around in. (The burnouts were the reason I have rebuilt the diff and geabox. Funny but they didn't agree with that driving style )

What have you done to yourself? Was it a result of the last crash?

Making stuff, especially stuff you can't buy, is both fun, cheap and satisfying.

No I was born a NUTTER to sum it up without getting indepth.
But I'm usually a NUTTER.
Not a :x NUTTER.
"USUALLY".

 

[Customcreations]

[Quote:]

Making stuff, especially stuff you can't buy, is both fun, cheap and satisfying.[/QUOTE]

It sure is satisfying and all of the above.
I have just about finished making an adaptor to fit a 6 bolt flywheel (instead of the 8 bolt F/W) to my Holden VS Commodore Auto to manual conversion.
The 8 bolt F/W sells for $250+ second hand and is sort after due to limmited availability.
I already had a spare 6 Bolt F/W but they are cheap to buy in comparison at around $50 S/H. Machined up an adaptor boss/plate and am just doing the final fit now to make sure it sits centred and with no wobbles. Still tossing up wether or not I'll get it balanced. It's hard to find a place around here that does F/W balancing.
The other advantage is the 6 Bolt design is ALOT lighter than the 8 Bolt.
I'm going to get an approx weight difference tonight. (So basically I'm getting a lightened flywheel for a fraction of the cost of a PRO one plus I can then sell the 8 bolt F/W for a good price)
Which brings me to a Q about weight of the flywheel and where the weight is positioned on the different flywheels.
The 8 bolt (heavier F/W) has a Thick and solid ring of steel( by ring I mean just thicker casting, not an added ring) at the outer diameter of the F/W. and in centre its very thin, VERY, VERY thin for a F/W if you ask me. The 6 Bolt F/W (which is the lighter F/W) is heaps thinner at the outer diameter and has a more solid centre.

If you had a 2 flywheels (F/W) that are the same weight as each other but the 1 has most of its mass at the outer diameter,
and the other has most of its mass in the centre. That would affect the responce differently to each other wouldn't it?? The 1st with the most mass at the outer diameter would create more "stored energy" where as the second with most mass at the centre would have a far quicker reponse in the revs (and drop off quicker)
Reminder; I am talking about 2 equally weighted F/W but with the weight positioned in these 2 different ways. Hope this all makes sense and If you don't want this Q asked on this thread I will happily move it . Definately dont want to hijack this thread.
Also, do you have an equasion for working out the change in response when lightening a F/W?

 

[Jakeymd]

In response to your flywheel question, then you are certainly correct. With equal masses but different shapes they would act the way you described

 

[Customcreations]

In response to your flywheel question, then you are certainly correct. With equal masses but different shapes they would act the way you described

Thanks. Thought that sounded right (in my head)

I'm curious to see how much change it's going to make.
With the 6 bolt setup its lighter aswell as the majority of the MASS is centred. I don't mind that idea at all. I prefer to use gearing to slow quicker than using the brakes as much.
I'm going to weigh the 2 different F/W's now just out of curiousity.
It must be a fair bit as you can tell just from comparing the 2 by hand.

 

[Jakeymd]

It should make a big difference with it being lighter in the first instance and with the mass much closer the the centre.

I have a Dual Mass Flywheel in the Focus and I think it might be on it's way out. I just don't want to believe it because it's expensive to replace.

 

[old-git]

Replace it with a standard flywheel and clutch.

 

[Customcreations]

I just weighed the 2 in at:
8 Bolt heavy banger F/W weighs in at approx 10.9kg
6 bolt wizzer F/W weighs in at approx 9.2kg
= 1.7KG lighter. Thats bound to make a massive difference to the response.

How do you like that one for a weight reduction O-G

Not to mesion the bulk of that weight is in close to the centre of F/W.
Cant wait to try it out.
I want to get the conversion on the VS finished this week.

I have a Dual Mass Flywheel in the Focus and I think it might be on it's way out. I just don't want to believe it because it's expensive to replace

how does the dual mass work?
Is that so you have a quick response but then kicks in extra mass to give the stored energy for cruising??

 

[Customcreations]

Jakeymd,
are you in South Australia?
There does seem to be some secondies (DM F/W)for not too much on Ebay

 

[Jakeymd]

Nah, I'm on the other side of the World. We're the right way up.

 

[Jakeymd]

Replace it with a standard flywheel and clutch.

I have thought aboutbit but Im worried it would damage the gearbox.

 

[Customcreations]

Can't see it damaging the gearbox unless you are a mad driver.
There's some cheap priced Flyheels UP your way on Ebay if you cant afford to buy new.
I tell you what though, there seems to be some nice performance F/W pretty cheap too. Take a look.

 

[Customcreations]

Nah, I'm on the other side of the World. We're the right way up.

You may be the right way up but at least over here we don't freeze in winter.:bigsmile:
(Mind you I'd prefer a -15deg with central heating to -1 with none.)
Plus I remember feeling less cold in holland at -5 to -8deg and being all dressed for the occasion. Than here always being cold 1 minute then
Feeling sweaty and clammy the next at 5 to 10 deg.
It's probably because at sub zero temps you loose all feeling anyway

 

[old-git]

Right, back on topic

Spoke to chassis and suspension guru and he is happy with wishbone design so I just need to make the other 3.

Made brackets to hold rear wheel sensors. Thought these would be tricky but ended up quite simple.

http://www.torquecars.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=1674&stc=1&d=1337610777

http://www.torquecars.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=1676&stc=1&d=1337610777

http://www.torquecars.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=1675&stc=1&d=1337610777

 

[Jakeymd]

Right, back on topic

Sorry

 

[old-git]

Sorry

No problem, just try not to do it again, at least for a couple of days

 

[Customcreations]

No problem, just try not to do it again, at least for a couple of days

Sorry from me too
Got carried away

BUT I am hurting after 2 6hr stints of filing the crankshaft to get it square again. (dodgy GM workmanship I think)

Sorry again. Cant help myself.

I do like the pics of the Sensor brackets, man I wish I had some of your toys.

OOPS you said a couple of days, Ithought it was a couple of hours:cheesy:

 

[Jakeymd]

You should start your own thread

 

[old-git]

The toys are fun, not very expensive (as a start, a combined lathe and mill for around £560 new) and have already paid for themselves. However, I appreciate that space can often be the problem.

 

[Customcreations]

You should start your own thread

I did start my own thread but :sad2:.
No one was interested. Probably cause I rant to much.

One day I'll get my owm milling machine and then I'll be :bigsmile:.
Incase you didn't read my thread it was about checking the crankshaft is square where F/W blots up. My F/W had around 2mm wobble O/D.
Centering was OK. Just major wobble. Thought it might have been my Adaptor but the Stock F/W did it too. Checked the Crank with a Micrometer and found the culprit. That's GMH for you. (Mind you I recon any car make could have same too). Who ever checks for Woble when doing the F/W.??