Speed limit if no signs showing

glabus

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Re: Describe the skill of anticipation

Q If there are NO road signs what is the speed limit?
(I'll give a quote reply AFTER some one answers):blink1::blink1
 
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Re: Describe the skill of anticipation

Glabus - no road signs, national limit unless the road is illuminated with lamp posts spaced a certain distance apart where a 30 limit will apply.
 
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Re: Describe the skill of anticipation

I AM puzzled:blink: by your reply to me!

It seems that I have missed something somewhere as I have not heard the national limit quote:confused: though I , obviously; expected respondees to say 30 (adding the HC wording as you have) maybe.
We should also include the " commensurate with road and Traffic conditions":cheesy:

HOWEVER
It very often seems that some drivers translate the spacing of lamps and no sign to be an irrelevance and consider the limit to be whatever speed THEY fancy doing!!

Cannot we all quote instances of being overtaken or following a driver doing well over 30??? Of course we can!

Near where we live there is a sign for 20 going passed a school area. people still do 40 or more.

On the road to Brid there is now a section at 30 which DOES seem to be a pointless reduction on that stretch and that is exactly what some drivers think apparently. It is pointless so it doesn't apply to me let's[get the foot down:amazed:

There will always be fools and dangerous drivers (male & female, Young & old) let us pray daily that our encounters with them are few and hope that OUR intuitions (6th sense) observancies and experience will help us stay safe from harm Amen
 
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i failed a driving test cause of this. was going an area that was 50. came to a 't' junction and turned left. no signs on junction to say wot speed is the limit so i assumed it was still 50. it wasnt it was 40 and duely failed my test for doing 50 on a 40. the next sign was over 3/4's of a mile from the junction to say the limit and i was really peeved to say the least.
 
firstly, you must have been upset (I'm being polite:lol:) to get same guy for each Test!
I think that I might have wanted to query the decision to fail me IF the incident you quoted was the ONLY reason for failure. I was under the impression that you maintained the limit of the last sign seen ( like continuing to follow last order/s given in Forces!) Therefore if, as you claim; the 40 sign was not at the entry to this road then you were correct. Maybe you should have done what I used to instruct pupils to do. Don't try to chat to the examiner but DO query something your not sure of. I.e, IF he does not tell you to turn or go straight ahead ask him so you can adjust the car to required actions.
On your next attempt, seeing same chap you mentally adjusted yourself not to get caught out and ending up going too slow. (incidentally) I was given a mates' female pupil to try to figure out why she had failed for gears! It took me 3 lessons including the disclosure one as a mock Test before I got it. Having stopped to be told to be ready for an Emergency stop she did a few turns etc first. She didn't change up to 4th!!
Minor or even ridiculous reason for getting failed but there you go:bigsmile:
Maybe by the third you thought you might as well drive as you normally did and that got you passed
took me 3 attempts to pass my test waynne, failed my 1st for the incident above, second one for going too slow, 30 in a 40, and passed on my 3rd.
had the same examiner 3 times.
 
that was the only things i had wrong on my test. as they are major faults i failed. and yes by the 3rd time and seen the examiner was the same again i thought B****** to it and drove as a normal person and passed. was excited to say the least, and also felt like saying 'haha i can do it' to the examiner, but refrained from doing so as i was chuffed !!
 
If no signs or lamp columns and road is single carriageway - 60mph (national speed limit for this type of road)

If no signs and dual carriageway - 70mph (national speed limit for this type of road)

No signs but a series of lamp columns (3 or more spaced no further than 186m apart) then limit is 30mph, even on a dual carriageway. Lamps do not have to be illuminated, even at night.

Any questions? :)
 
I think it would be a good idea to mount 30mph repeater signs on the lighting poles. This shouldn't cost too much because the lighting poles are already there for the signs to be mounted upon. Would also require minor change in legislation. Yet strangely 20mph limits are posted yet they have to be self-enforcing.

The street light spacing in my opinion is not adequate, especially if it's a London Red Route and the opportunity to park the car and get out the tape measure to check the light spacing is not available. Then again, how many of us have ever managed to get anywhere near 30mph on one of those? :D:D
 
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Thanks for reminding me of this:bigsmile:
Actually I was getting myself just thinking of the spaced lamps and forgetting the single/dual carriageway situations:embarrest:
If no signs or lamp columns and road is single carriageway - 60mph (national speed limit for this type of road)

If no signs and dual carriageway - 70mph (national speed limit for this type of road)

No signs but a series of lamp columns (3 or more spaced no further than 186m apart) then limit is 30mph, even on a dual carriageway. Lamps do not have to be illuminated, even at night.

Any questions? :)
 
basically if the road looks dangerous and there is no lights u can do 60mph, if the road looks safe with lights do 30mph. who makes up these laws

The national speed limits are MAXIMUMS, not targets :) It is assumed (wrongly on a lot of occasions) that drivers have common sense and some driving skills with a little bit of self preservsation thrown in.

ALL roads are safe, it's the idiots behind the wheels that are dangerous.
 
I think it would be a good idea to mount 30mph repeater signs on the lighting poles. This shouldn't cost too much because the lighting poles are already there for the signs to be mounted upon. Would also require minor change in legislation. Yet strangely 20mph limits are posted yet they have to be self-enforcing.

The street light spacing in my opinion is not adequate, especially if it's a London Red Route and the opportunity to park the car and get out the tape measure to check the light spacing is not available. Then again, how many of us have ever managed to get anywhere near 30mph on one of those? :D:D

If you were to mount repeaters on lamp columns (which are repeaters in themselves), you would need to install termination signs and issue a traffic regulation order.

The cost of doing this (ignoring the maintenance of signs) on every estate road in the country would bankrupt the County Councils.

With only one repeater missing the TRO becomes unenforcable so obtaining a speeding conviction becomes a nightmare. Very few lamp columns get nicked so the existing system is cheap, easy to maintain/enforce and all drivers should understand it. If not, they should not be driving.

Very few lighting systems are spaced as far apart as 186m so there is no real need to measure them - Unless you get nicked for speeding :)
 
If you were to mount repeaters on lamp columns (which are repeaters in themselves), you would need to install termination signs and issue a traffic regulation order.

The cost of doing this (ignoring the maintenance of signs) on every estate road in the country would bankrupt the County Councils.

With only one repeater missing the TRO becomes unenforcable so obtaining a speeding conviction becomes a nightmare. Very few lamp columns get nicked so the existing system is cheap, easy to maintain/enforce and all drivers should understand it. If not, they should not be driving.

Very few lighting systems are spaced as far apart as 186m so there is no real need to measure them - Unless you get nicked for speeding :)



I know all of this and I have no problem with the current system for my own purposes. I'm very aware of whatever speed limit is in force and comply with it.

According to you the priority is obtaining convictions.

If the signs I suggested have the desired effect then drivers would slow down and thereby safety would improve. Convictions would fall. That's got to be good.

Who cares if obtaining a conviction becomes a nightmare if the overall effect has been to reduce traffic speed?

I have never known a lamp column be 'nicked'. Does that happen where you are? It doesn't happen here. I don't live on an 'estate road', whatever one of those is.

Do you live on one of those 'estate roads' roads to which you refer?

As for bankrupting the County Councils I have little sympathy. Why charge us for something that is not effective? If what they are doing now is not effective then stop charging us for it.

I also doubt that it would bankrupt the County Councils to install a few signs here and there.

You say that very few lighting columns are placed exactly 186m apart. From this I can logically deduce that SOME ARE!!! So why not bolt on the signs anyway? It might well assist in reducing speeds! Shouldn't cost that much, should it? There won't be many signs needed if the lamps are that far apart.

Steve, you've shown your true colours here. In my opinion they are those of a committed bureaucrat.

Paul Anderson
 
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I am indeed not acquainted with council workings and procedures. But if they are a horrific as you say then surely it's time to make a few changes.

As for the traffic calming here, it's had the precisely opposite effect. Bucks CC is devoid of any talent whatsoever:

Width restrictors which are on the unmade side of the road, thus forcing all the vehicles closer to pedestrians.

Changing the 40mph limit to 30mph, thus removing all the signs. The average speeds have gone up. The street lighting is inadequately maintained yet we're charged for its maintenance.

What's the point?

Feel free to write.

Likewise, feel free to drive over and have a look for yourself. The kettle works well and I'm quite handy at knocking up some decent sandwiches.
 
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It's interesting that the reference to street light distance with respect to speed has been removed from The Highway Code. Now it's simply street lighting.

However, as far as I know, if there is no street lighting and no repeater signs there is in fact no limit on the road.
 
It's interesting that the reference to street light distance with respect to speed has been removed from The Highway Code. Now it's simply street lighting.

However, as far as I know, if there is no street lighting and no repeater signs there is in fact no limit on the road.
it would be national speed limit


another one to think about - signs.
im pretty sure that you have to pass through a "gate" for the speed limit. if you go into a 40 that doesnt have repeaters (mandatory requirement) and one of the 1st signs has been knocked down then what is the speed limit ?
 
I am not sure what you mean Re a 'gate'
It would seem that as you approach a higher or lower limit then there will be the 1st sign seen some reasonable distance ahead of you!
Is this your theoretical gate?
In other words you should have time to reduce (or increase) speed to be travelling at the required new limit. always assuming no other traffic is in front:bigsmile:.
Should the 1st sign not be there then one can assume the limit has not changed yet:confused:. A PO may that a different attitude especially a local bobby!
You should be able to argue any fine successfully but.........
There are some many roads where signs are hidden by shrubbery etc and, of course; many drivers who just don't bother to slow down:sad2:QUOTE=pgarner;140273]it would be national speed limit


another one to think about - signs.
im pretty sure that you have to pass through a "gate" for the speed limit. if you go into a 40 that doesnt have repeaters (mandatory requirement) and one of the 1st signs has been knocked down then what is the speed limit ?[/QUOTE]
 
no i meant a gate where there is signs on both sides of the roads. it was a foreman that works for the council that was telling me as a mate had been done for going through a no entry sign at night where both lamps had blown- council knew but hadn't fixed them - and so they couldn't be seen well enough. it was at that point he pointed out one entry to the town you could continue at 60mph for another 1/2mile due to a 30 sign having been knocked down and no street lights
 
I'm still a bit confused:confused:
I now take your 'gate' to refer to an imaginary line where the two signs on either side of the road are situated?
Surely there should be signs at both sides!
with regard to the No entry 'mistake'.
1stly, As I wasn't there I can only assume that if it was nighttime this driver DID have lights on? Therefore, it would be assumed that though the sign lights might have blown, he should have been able to distinquish the sign anyway Ergo, no excuse!!:(
2nd, IF the limit went from 60 to 30 and the drivers were able to travel 1/2 a mile before the next proper sign, WHY were there NO street lights:confused:Personally, I think this Council should be sued for not doing its job properly and, any fines imposed turned over
no i meant a gate where there is signs on both sides of the roads. it was a foreman that works for the council that was telling me as a mate had been done for going through a no entry sign at night where both lamps had blown- council knew but hadn't fixed them - and so they couldn't be seen well enough. it was at that point he pointed out one entry to the town you could continue at 60mph for another 1/2mile due to a 30 sign having been knocked down and no street lights
 
youve got the idea with the gate (30) (30).
yes he did have his lights on. he ended up going the wrong way at the time it had not long changed

As the entry to the town there are no lights and you dont need repeater signs for 30 within the town. as for no street lights dunno but as theres nothing out there other than a farm so i cant see the point for the 30mph being there. this has also changed 30 now starts just before the houses however there are now speed bumps and chicanes
 
OK PG..
We seem to have sorted this and the bit about the road direction being changed reminds me of a tale years ago when a friend had parked his car correctly in a one way only to get done the next day as the direction had been reversed during the night!!!:amazed:.
IIRC there never are repeater signs in 30 zones. That is why many drivers seem to think they can travel at any speed they like:bigsmile:
If there is only a farm then I agree, why a 30?:confused:
There is a stretch on the road to Bridlington where they have done the same thing. There seems no apparent logic to the restriction and SO.... many drivers ignore them:sad2:
In regard to the fine for one way transgression.
It is unfortunate but, even if there has been no prior information (signs, or ads in papers, local radio & TV or letters to local householders etc. These fines still stand:confused::sad2:
We (and anyone else?? ) can carry on or... leave it there and move on. I am happy to converse, debate, argue, inform, upset with ANYONE HERE:lol::lol::lol: NO not upset:embarrest:
youve got the idea with the gate (30) (30).
yes he did have his lights on. he ended up going the wrong way at the time it had not long changed

As the entry to the town there are no lights and you dont need repeater signs for 30 within the town. as for no street lights dunno but as theres nothing out there other than a farm so i cant see the point for the 30mph being there. this has also changed 30 now starts just before the houses however there are now speed bumps and chicanes
 

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