How much longer have diesels got

obi_waynne

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There is more and more negativity towards diesels, once heralded as economical and efficient now vilified as lethal pollutants!

Will we always have diesels, have petrol engines come far enough to close the gap, are your views of diesel changing?
 

Cubefish

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Given that diesels are more efficient than petrol engines, are they more polluting per mile, or more polluting per litre? If the latter, then it's feasible that diesels are less, or as, polluting per mile as a petrol engine.

We need to find a fuel source that is not derived from the oil industry, and one that won't impact on food supplies, which rules out biofuels.
 

obi_waynne

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There was a guy on the radio saying diesels are dead and that some new petrol engines return over 70mpg. I had to smile, they may do the economy but there is no performance at all from them.
 

HDi fun

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That's the problem I think. The super low consumption petrol engines can be spineless. But, and it's a big but, diesels don't really do all that well in terms of pence per mile. The fuel is costlier and the servicing is costlier in the long run.

And are decent performing petrols really that thirsty? The current BMW 530i Auto boasts over 250bhp, 0-60 in sub seven seconds and a claimed 38mpg.

If you managed 30-35 in general driving (which is possible without being too gentle) then it's a bargain.

The OK, the equivalent 530d claims 53mpg (also unlikely that you'll get anywhere near this) but it costs £3000 more. It's also half a second quicker to 60mph so I really am stuck now.

I think it's cyclic. Diesel has had massive industry investment and made it gorgeous to drive and refined.

It's petrol's turn for a cash injection now.

Plug in electric should be getting attention now.
 

Aerial Andy944

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I think diesel still has some mileage in it (excuse the pun:rolleyes:) majority of the family car's I see on the road are still diesel powered. The only modern petrol engine I've driven is the new Mondeo 1.6 turbo 150hp version and it was guuuuutless. Cannot see how it could haul 1570 kilos of car around efficiently.
 

HDi fun

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I think diesel still has some mileage in it (excuse the pun:rolleyes:) majority of the family car's I see on the road are still diesel powered. The only modern petrol engine I've driven is the new Mondeo 1.6 turbo 150hp version and it was guuuuutless. Cannot see how it could haul 1570 kilos of car around efficiently.

It's easy to get into the diesel frame of mind and expect stacks of torque well below 2000rpm. Diesel will always win that game. Drive a petrol engine and use the full rev range and it all evens out. Gearing swaps revs for torque.
 

herb

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I've got to admit when I bought my current 1.5 diesel I thought I would get fernominal mpg!
But reality puts my car atm at 47.5mpg
I don't know whether it's my driving style but atm on the dash it's slowly going up and currently showing 53mpg so I'll stick at it see if I can get it upto near the 60mpg mark
 

HDi fun

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That's the problem I think. The super low consumption petrol engines can be spineless. But, and it's a big but, diesels don't really do all that well in terms of pence per mile. The fuel is costlier and the servicing is costlier in the long run.

And are decent performing petrols really that thirsty? The current BMW 530i Auto boasts over 250bhp, 0-60 in sub seven seconds and a claimed 38mpg.

If you managed 30-35 in general driving (which is possible without being too gentle) then it's a bargain.

The OK, the equivalent 530d claims 53mpg (also unlikely that you'll get anywhere near this) but it costs £3000 more. It's also half a second quicker to 60mph so I really am stuck now.

I think it's cyclic. Diesel has had massive industry investment and made it gorgeous to drive and refined.

Plug in electric should be getting attention now
 

obi_waynne

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Plug in electric should be getting attention now

Not from me! I have a mate with a Note, on a long run he is quite happy to wait almost an hour to charge it up enroute! Crazy!

Around town I can ALMOST see the sense. Performance plugins are hopefully just around the corner with a decent range and fast charge time.
 

HDi fun

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Tesla has the performance thing cracked totally. The charge time and range are the let downs at the moment. Time and uptake will help this, in the same was a a distribution network for petrol was established in response to demand for the stuff.
 

HDi fun

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The pence-per-mile fuel figures are always nice.

I am not totally convinced that the exhaust output is quite as bad as we're told.

The latest bunch of Euro VI derv engines with selective catalytic reduction exhaust treatment should be about as clean as internal combustion is likely to get. The problem is that the additives used are not especially nice.

Many commerical engines have been using this system for some time. AdBlue is readily available at all fuel stations which accomodate large goods vehicles.
 

obi_waynne

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Planes, ferries and busses are much bigger polluters. Ferrys are hard to enforce, if the regs are too tight they will just register the ferry in another country! You can see the black smoke billowing out of them as they come and go from the harbour.
 

obi_waynne

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Interesting fact now i've looked it up....
CO2 emissions from a ferry run at 1.03 kg / mile per passenger, calculated from data which found Mersey ferries generate 48 kg CO2 per ferry km, and the average ferry occupancy was 74.7 passengers.

A car generates 300-400 grammes of CO2 per mile 33-37mpg.

CO2 is certainly not the whole story though.
 

SLEEPER

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I dont think comparing cars to ship are of any use at all snsport
Its comparing apples with goats not oranges - they are two unconnected forms of transport

We need to get about on land and move things across the sea and nothing does both. Ships are ships so compare them and the same with cars.

Personally I cant see deisels dying out - we need a power source for the trasport industry and deisel wins hands down as you need big torque and less power to lug containers and the like about.

The really interesting thing is where will the electric factor take us . It seems to be suited to go with pertrol not deisel set ups but things do change.
 

obi_waynne

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Without the masses of Torque a diesel engine offers wouldn't switching to petrol engined HGV be much like having a motorbike engined car? You'd have to rev it really high to get the thing moving?
 

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