Does oil affect performance

[obi_waynne]

I've noted that a car feels faster and seems to return better MPG after switching to a higher quality oil.

Do you agree with my "feelings" on this? Will engine oil choice make much of a difference to a cars performance or economy? Are there any studies or road tests that would confirm this? What are your thoughts on this?

 

[oilman]

Hi

Yes, that should be the case, if the right oil is used. The better an oil is, the less friction there should be, meaning more power and better mpg. I don't know how much you can notice yourself, but the right oils can make a difference.

Cheers

Tim

 

[andyalbone]

they did a test on 5th gear with a R32 golf im sure they did a rolling road before and after oil change and it improved ever so slighly

 

[SLEEPER]

If an oil reduces friction and a better one reduces more then it must make a difference but whether it is noticeable may be questionable.

I think it is more a question of how long it keeps its properties.

On a high power turbo engine for example the tempretures are very high so a better oil should give better protection especially if running high boost and high revs.

 

[old-git]

Think of oil as a high performance engine component. You wouldn't fit cheap, no name con rods to a 500bhp motor, would you?

 

[TCJBOLDIE]

Good analogy OG

 

[TCJBOLDIE]

One reason why a synthetic oil is better than mineral is that syn oil is more shear resistant and all the molecules are the same size .

 

[rodhotter]

a little more explicitly group IV + V true synthetics perform best, racing synthetics can gain power but are not for daily driving as the detergents + antioxidents are minimal. in the USA group III hydrocracked mineral oils are labeled "synthetic" since 1999 thanks to Castrol. just read where Germany's Group III oils are NOT legally synthetic. can anyone verify what european or any countries that this is in effect

 

[yankfan101]

But do the more expensive brands go thinner quicker , hence spending more. ?

 

[rodhotter]

a little more explicitly group IV + V true synthetics perform best, racing synthetics can gain power but are not for daily driving as the detergents + antioxidents are minimal. in the USA group III hydrocracked mineral oils are labeled "synthetic" since 1999 thanks to Castrol. just read where Germany's Group III oils are NOT legally synthetic. can anyone verify what european or any countries that this is in effect

 

[rodhotter]

real synthetics that is group IV + V oils are superior by nature, they have NO WAX in them as do the other groups, they are shear stable with little or no additives, being a high natural viscosity that stays that way. because the specs you see are for a finished new oil with additives, specs can be misleading. mineral oils need + use fragile viscosity improvers that can go away quickly, they also need + use pour point depressants for low pour points. these two specs are easily "propped up" but do not last!!! a PAO 30 wt is naturally a 10-30 but a mineral oil may start as a 20 wt base stock with the a for mentioned additives to reach 10 + 30 specs. a wider spread as a 10-40 requires even more additives. better oils use better add packs even group III, but superior oils use even better formulations. look on Amsoil.com for lots of specs on their products, note the high TBN which allows longer drains. they also have fake synthetics at lower prices that are quite good. a great site to learn the meanings of specs is themotoroilevaluator.com, they note how some oils give little info because its NOT GOOD. they list specs for over a thousand oils, its free just register. paying members get more benefits as well.

 

[T9 man]

^^ Thanks for that rodhotter, I learnt a few things there I was totally unaware off

 

[TCJBOLDIE]

Another thing is that budget priced oils additive packs usually only sufficient to just get them into spec/grade but will not stay there for long and need to be changed sooner than oils that have more of or better add packs that get them into the top end of the specs thereby staying within grade longer.
Rodhotter I have been told by an oil chemist that a higher viscosity index number is also a good indication of a better grade oil?

 

[thexav]

No oil at all is a bad thing, just ask my cousin Richard! The warning light came on just as the engine seized up!

 

[Ivy]

Yes. A ECM Booster throttle controller accelerator can do this.

It can improve electronic throttle's sensitivity. And make my car more Effective. And saving energy. I installed one A month ago.Is very cool . Let you feel so good when driving.

If you need it , I can give you the information to buy. I buy from China. *Removed text as this is advertising and not remotely anything to do with the thread*

T9 man
Super Moderator.

I've noted that a car feels faster and seems to return better MPG after switching to a higher quality oil.

Do you agree with my "feelings" on this? Will engine oil choice make much of a difference to a cars performance or economy? Are there any studies or road tests that would confirm this? What are your thoughts on this?

 

[jarrus]

real synthetics that is group IV + V oils are superior by nature, they have NO WAX in them as do the other groups, they are shear stable with little or no additives, being a high natural viscosity that stays that way. because the specs you see are for a finished new oil with additives, specs can be misleading. mineral oils need + use fragile viscosity improvers that can go away quickly, they also need + use pour point depressants for low pour points. these two specs are easily "propped up" but do not last!!! a PAO 30 wt is naturally a 10-30 but a mineral oil may start as a 20 wt base stock with the a for mentioned additives to reach 10 + 30 specs. a wider spread as a 10-40 requires even more additives. better oils use better add packs even group III, but superior oils use even better formulations. look on Amsoil.com for lots of specs on their products, note the high TBN which allows longer drains. they also have fake synthetics at lower prices that are quite good. a great site to learn the meanings of specs is themotoroilevaluator.com, they note how some oils give little info because its NOT GOOD. they list specs for over a thousand oils, its free just register. paying members get more benefits as well.

Castrol Magatec is supposed to be one of those type 3 oils that say fully synthetic when it's not really the case,
AMSOIL is hard to come by in the UK and is very expensive so I've never used it,
I used to use Castrol Edge but switched to Fuchs Titan Pro S,

 

[rodhotter]

oil generally will not add power except, oils for racing only. true group IV + V synthetics prolly add a little but actually not noticeable. important differences in oil groups, for instance a group IV like Amsoil 10-30 starts as a 30 wt but meets the 10 wt spec, NO viscosity index improvers at all, group III legally synthetic in USA + down a 10-30 starts as a 10 wt then viscosity index improvers are added to reach a 30 wt spec. VII DO NOT last so the less used the better. an oils spec for viscosity index can be easily "propped up" as noted in reading on oil evaluators site, a higher shear # is a good indication of a better oil. many manufactures give few or only the better specs.Pennzoil platinum is a group III "synthetic" in the USA but coming from GTL technology its cleaner + better performing. at this time to my knowlege the only place the GTL comes from is the plant in Qatar + sold under the Pennzoil brand. technology never stops + you can always learn if you have the time to read, i prefer the computer to TV + now being retired i read + learn about things interesting to me. same info from different sources generally are truthful!!!

 

[jarrus]

I thought GTL technology was used for making cleaner diesel fuel

 

[st24]

All very complex indeed.
Please someone tell me whats the best possible money no object oil I can use in my Insignia cdti repmobile tractor?

 

[TCJBOLDIE]

In the old days way back before synthetics the speedway drivers seemed to prefer Pennzoil as it was a parafinic base crude that only came from a few oil fields. If there was any basis for the superiority of this oil I am not sure.

Maybe our resident oil guru Opie can chime in with his greater knowledge on the subject??

 

[oilman]

Hi

Better oil = less friction
less friction = greater efficiency
greater efficiency =more power/better economy.

So the simple answer is, a better oil can improve performance. Using thinner oils can help by reducing internal resistance as well, so things like drag cars will use really thin oils to maximise performance.

You may well not notice the difference in performance as the gains are not spectacular, but there are certain things you would notice like smoother running of the engine. Fuchs/Silkolene did an experiment a few years ago, with a team of Honda Blackbirds. If I remember correctly, they gained about 7-8% power in reducing the viscosity of the oil used from 15w-50 to 0w-20. That was using the Silkolene Pro R oils (so top end stuff), but such a large reduction in viscosity is only sensible where you don't mind replacing the engines on a fairly regular basis.

Millers Nanodrive oils take friction reduction a step further than other oils and they have shown some pretty good performance gains.

http://www.millersoils.co.uk/nanodrive.asp

As well as what they show, we have had customers reporting performance and economy improvements with the Nanodrive oils.

Cheers

Tim

 

[MikeMcCarthy]

From my experience too thick of a viscosity or excessive oil pressure both will hurt performance . I run 30 weight Brad Penn in my turbo bug and run higher oil pressure than most run to protect my engine internals rather than worrying about extracting every last HP out of it. On my last tear down the bearings still looked good enough to use them over , but I didn't lol. Mike

 

[rodhotter]

generally unless your using "racing" only oil gains are minute. lighter oils are good as long as they get the job done, example of my 2001 audi TT 225Q, modified to about 300 hp + tq. i was using amsoil 10-30 signature series said to be a PAO base oil, car was using prolly at least a qt in 500 miles, enter amsoil 10-40 premium synthetic, prolly not PAO but all group III oil, consumption is minimal now. if your "using" oil unless its leaking you can be contaminating your gas + air combustion process, this blowby will reduce power + can make pinging more likely if there were no knock sensors that pull timing + reduce power. most all "synthetics" today are cheaper but good highly refined crude oil. notice amsoil is not touting PAO anymore as they are quietly removing it for cheaper group III oil + "maybe" some PAO to meet a certain spec, oil blenders love the law change in 1999 allowing highly refined crude oil legally labeled "synthetic. i am switching from amsoil to Redline a real synthetic ester based oil

 

[MikeMcCarthy]

To me running lighter oil is the way to go as it will pass through the bearings/ tight places more easily/ quickly and remove unwanted heat away from those surfaces and yet lubricate as well as heavier oil if the oil itself is good. I added an extra 4 quarts to my system ( deep sump)and again I do not have any oil problems even when I twist it to 7800 rpm's . I have run Amsoil , in fact I still run it in my motorcycles and I have no complaints about it .

 

[TCJBOLDIE]

One thing to remember is that pressure is resistance to flow.

Can remember from long ago that one Formula Junior ran a low viscosity oil with Molybond added for wear protection and claimed that it gave a bit more power in a very competitive class.

 

[Guybo]

Cars now are very picky about motor oil, as tolerances are getting smaller with every new gen of engines. Oils have different detergents and additives too that can help to keep your engine clean and for the oil to last longer. Yes, oil is important and IMHO you should not cheap out on oil changes if you care about your car and its longevity.

Getting an oil change at a quick lube place is another mistake. the guy in the pit is usually stoned, he certainly doesn't care about whatever car is overhead and it's like an assemble line. Pay a little more and have it taken to a good garage or the dealership that sold you the car. You'll get software updates for your ECM if they are out, they will check the car over for you (although if you are on this forum you probably know your car better than they ever will!)

 

[HDi fun]

Low viscosity oil is always going to be better for flow rate. The reason heavier oils are employed in some engines is to accommodate the viscosity reduction at elevated operating temperatures. A 10w/60 in a hard driven BMW M5 will flow like a 5w/30 (for example) in a car driven with more normal underbonnet temperatures. The downside is that the more viscous oils do not flow as well during engine warm up and therefore drivers need to be aware of this and restrict their enthusiasm appropriately.

I think the days of after-market oil additives are over; I'm not sure they ever started tbh, it's a case of marketing style over substance.

 

[obi_waynne]

I think Viscosity is the hardest word to get your head round. Once I think I understand it I lose it again, it just doesn't "stick" in my mind!