Can you help me pick a good Diesel for my wife?

[LeadRogue]

Hello,

My wife is looking for a new car with a budget of about 6k max.

The car will be doing 80 motorway miles 5 days a week with about 15 miles of town driving.

She currently has a Hyundai Coupe 2.0i and she wants something more economical and would like to go down the diesel route.

She wants something with decent power enough to overtake easily etc.

To give you an idea she has been looking at the following cars

Toyota Auris 2007 SR180 2.2d
Mazda 3 2007 2.2d
Honda Accord 2006 2.2d
She has also looked at the civic 2.2d but I heard they are not so great.

Any advice on an alternative that we may not have thought of? Any help would be much appreciated.

Thanks in advance.
​

 

[lutonmatt]

i would look at some petrols as well as some of them give high mpg now some are better then the diesels
i know the civics are about the same and petrol being cheaper to buy car wise and at the pumps

 

[lutonmatt]

the mazda gives good mpg but never driven one

a vectra gives good mpg diesel one and a lot cheaper can get a 04 plate for 2k now

 

[Yugguy]

"I'd like a good diesel for the wife."
"Sounds like a fair swap to me."

Badumtish.

What about the ubiquitous vag diesel? Coupled with the dsg gearbox they make for stress-free commuting, and there's a million out there to choose from. Get the 140 and a remap so you don't get the dpf issues with the 170

 

[T9 man]

Greetings and Welcome!

 

[turbonutter69]

Hello and Welcome to TorqueCars.:bigsmile:
Hope you enjoy your time with us.

 

[HDi fun]

i would look at some petrols as well as some of them give high mpg now some are better then the diesels
i know the civics are about the same and petrol being cheaper to buy car wise and at the pumps

They will give good mileage but if we compare a 1.6 petrol Auris to a 2.2 diesel the petrol one is going to be so flat and spineless to drive. The Mazda has Ford's lovely 2.2 TDCi unit installed. It's a cracking engine but some have reported long term reliability issues. I am unable to determine whether the problems perceived are real or just the result of poor servicing.

If your mind is made up on diesel (as mine would be) then all of these cars will give you good results. Go and test drive, see what you like, what suits you. Judge each on its own merits.

Any one of these cars will flatten the Hyundai for overtaking prowess. There is no comparison.

 

[jarrus]

Yeah I was going to say that, yes some petrols will be just as economical as the diesels but they will be spineless in comparison. Diesels are a good compromise on performance and economy.

Also I would look at the Honda Civic 2.2 I-CDTI as they are smooth and swift and really nice to drive. Not sure you can get them for 6k though. Also look for volve c30 D5's

 

[HDi fun]

Yeah I was going to say that, yes some petrols will be just as economical as the diesels but they will be spineless in comparison. Diesels are a good compromise on performance and economy.

Also I would look at the Honda Civic 2.2 I-CDTI as they are smooth and swift and really nice to drive. Not sure you can get them for 6k though. Also look for volve c30 D5's

It's a good option.

 

[obi_waynne]

The VW PD1.9 engine is a good option, especailly the 150 bhp version. Get her a Golf GTTDi and she'll have fun and great economy and relatively cheap insurance and low running costs.

 

[stamford]

A friend of mine has had a few TD Golfs, all went like stink with a 6 speed box and got stupidly high mpg figures, made me feel really sick! Nice smooth drive and clocked up some miles in them with little problems.

 

[jarrus]

They are quick admittedly, but they are a very dull drive and very heavy so they don't do corners well. Engines are great the rest of the car isn't....

 

[bigbadjoe]

Hello and Welcome.

A few good suggestions, but I think they have missed the point.

A good, reliable, fast, and eco car would be a Volvo S40/80 (depending on size).

The D5's go like stink and are good on the juice. They are nice to sit in, and great for motorway miles. You should get a nice 06 model for around 6K. And, you will have no trouble overtaking in one of them!

 

[bigbadjoe]

Sorry Jarrus, just seen the bottom of your post about the D5's. I wouldn't have throught you would get a C30 for that price tho.

 

[HDi fun]

The VW PD1.9 engine is a good option, especailly the 150 bhp version. Get her a Golf GTTDi and she'll have fun and great economy and relatively cheap insurance and low running costs.

The 150 engine is very lively indeed and the fuel economy is good. They also remap well. 200bhp plus is easy to achieve. However - the cam belt interval on some PDs has been pulled as low as 18,000 miles due to the load the which unit injectors place upon the belt. This can have a major impact upon long term running costs.

Contrast this with the 96,000 mile interval on my 2.2 HDi 16 valve unit. Later cars I think go to 136,000 miles with no belt change.

I also find the VAG's 4 cylinder PD engines quite coarse and intrusive compared to others' offerings.

The later CR offerings by VAG are much better in both respects and should not be dismissed. 2.0 TDi 170 being one such example.

 

[LeadRogue]

She drove the Auris SR180 yesterday and said it was brilliant. Sorry im presuming VAG is a golf? sorry i dont know these terms yet. Also what is the CR?

 

[HDi fun]

VAG is VW Audi.

CR is common rail fuelling. This is the standard mechanism now, VW has retired the PD (pumpe duse unit injector systems). PD injectors are operated by the (single) camshaft and the shock loading on the drive belts is high.

The PSA (Peugeot Citroen) HDi units were the first common rail mass market diesel cars back in 1997/98 !! Your Focus TDCi is a common rail diesel engine.

All modern diesel engines use common rail injection which is fully managed by the ECU.

The Auris 180 is lovely - quick and refined. Toyota engines are very hard, if not impossible to remap and so you have no easy tuning opportunites but one has to question whether you need any more than 180bhp and the corresponding torque (probably close on 300lbft) anyway in a car the size of an Auris.

Go and try the Golf TDi 170 as well - that's a good motor.

BMW's 3 series Touring is sublime in 325d form with the 3.0 litre engine. Being a straight six it brings smoothness and refinement in spades but the car doesn't suit all tastes. They can also attract quite a price premium, possibly fairly- they are well put together and are in for the long haul but avoid paying for the badge alone is my advice.

Sorry I was thinking of 525d Touring. The 3 series was not made as a 325d. You can get a 330d. Unusually it has the same 2933cc engine as the 330d

 

[LeadRogue]

Thanks,

The wife was thinking of a remap to optimise efficiency but i did not know Toyota was difficult to do.

The golf you speak of 170bhp, would i stand any chance of getting one in budget?

my budget is now around £7k

Looks like the civic 2.2d looks very tunable

Also looked at some old stilos but yet to test drive as they can be remapped for huge gains apparently

 

[HDi fun]

Thanks,

The wife was thinking of a remap to optimise efficiency but i did not know Toyota was difficult to do.

The golf you speak of 170bhp, would i stand any chance of getting one in budget?

my budget is now around £7k

Looks like the civic 2.2d looks very tunable

Also looked at some old stilos but yet to test drive as they can be remapped for huge gains apparently

The Stilo still carries some of the later Fiat legacy. Earlier Fiats rusted. These don't. That is without dispute but the mechanicals have reportedly been a bit fragile. Interior quality is not stunning either. You can do better than this for £7k I think.

The place I recommend for diesel remapping is Celtic Tuning. Not that this is the only quality operator but I have direct personal experience of their work.

The Civic is tuneable but you won't get that 300lbft plus torque that competitive cars can offer.

No reason to dismiss it though. It's a good car.

It really is down to you to drive and decide which car it is that pleases you most. It's a nice segment in which to be buying - so many strong (very strong) performing cars in this sector.

 

[LeadRogue]

thanks for the info.

is it even possible to get over 300lb torque and 200 bhp with a remap on a motor thats done under 80k all for a budget of 7k?

 

[HDi fun]

thanks for the info.

is it even possible to get over 300lb torque and 200 bhp with a remap on a motor thats done under 80k all for a budget of 7k?

Totally so. The only thing you need to be careful with is that you comply with recommended service intervals. Remapping does take up the 'slack' in a engine's factory tune.

Car makers usually always undertune engines to ensure long term durability when it's driven savagely and servicing is neglected. (In the case of derv cars they had a recent habit of undertuning simply to leave a space in the market for equivalently priced petrol models).

Like any car, don't be harsh on it when it's cold, let it warm up fully before using ALL of the available torque and performance.


Also, with turbocharged cars (petrol or diesel) allow a minute or so before switching off if you've been driving 'hard'. This lets temperatures stabilise throughout the engine and it's associated fluids.

 

[LeadRogue]

so bang for buck whats the best diesel out there after remapping?

 

[HDi fun]

so bang for buck whats the best diesel out there after remapping?

Depend upon your definition of bang.

Looking at slightly larger cars the BMW 335d would probably be my model of choice. However, the interior is quite cramped and you're not going to get one for £7k. BMWs don't appeal to everyone, there's something about the image which the badge projects of its owners/drivers. I have one and I dislike the image it projects of me.

For sheer performance in a mid sized hatch I'd go for the Toyota to be honest. It's not easily remapped (and please do avoid ALL tuning boxes, in any car) but the engine is muscular and purposeful.

As a model in its own right it's ben shaken down and refined to a point of justifiable excellence.

You could look at Peugeot's 308 - 2.0 HDi but the engine, though silky, is nearly a generation off the mark for 2.2 litre diesels in performance terms

How about another Focus?

 

[LeadRogue]

had any experience of the 1.9 150 bhp astra?

 

[jarrus]

Yes, they are rabidly quick, remaps on those also yield very big gains, 212 hp and 327 lbft? yes please! also it;s enough to give the VXR a run for it's money.

 

[HDi fun]

had any experience of the 1.9 150 bhp astra?

Not directly, but, I do have an innate dislike of Vauxhall's cars. I think they are unreliable and costly to maintain. I have a similar disposition towards Renault and Rover.

 

[jarrus]

I've heard of your fathers experiences with vauxhall and yeah there not great, however though my sisters corsa is still working perfectly after a year of ownership and also my friends 1.6 astra is also very reliable, and has been since he's owned it (3 years) so all I can say is that your father must be one of the few unlucky ones, all car manufacture produce dodgy cars from time to time

2.2 Honda accords will remap with well over 300 lbft torque on them and into the 200's for hp.

Also it was fiat that made the first CR diesel as they invented it! They sold the rights to Bosch because they were in a heap of financial trouble and Bosch have since sold it to all the major manifactures of diesel engines first was PSA then everyone else followed suit.

 

[HDi fun]

I've heard of your fathers experiences with vauxhall and yeah there not great, however though my sisters corsa is still working perfectly after a year of ownership and also my friends 1.6 astra is also very reliable, and has been since he's owned it (3 years) so all I can say is that your father must be one of the few unlucky ones, all car manufacture produce dodgy cars from time to time

The bigger problem is that he thinks that the amount money he forks out is reasonable. Yet regards my E39 as a money pit. Which it isn't. It costs far far less to run and maintain than his car. How odd?

 

[turbonutter69]

I've heard of your fathers experiences with vauxhall and yeah there not great, however though my sisters corsa is still working perfectly after a year of ownership and also my friends 1.6 astra is also very reliable, and has been since he's owned it (3 years) so all I can say is that your father must be one of the few unlucky ones, all car manufacture produce dodgy cars from time to time

2.2 Honda accords will remap with well over 300 lbft torque on them and into the 200's for hp.

Also it was fiat that made the first CR diesel as they invented it! They sold the rights to Bosch because they were in a heap of financial trouble and Bosch have since sold it to all the major manifactures of diesel engines first was PSA then everyone else followed suit.

Yup my Focus is one of them.

 

[HDi fun]

Yup my Focus is one of them.

Changed your car, TN?

 

[turbonutter69]

No same old shed.

 

[jarrus]

@TN, seriously? I thought the focus was a very reliable car.

@P, In a way I can believe it. The E39 on the whole was a reliable car, then I again I should say so at the price it was when it was new. The E36's and the E46's not so much but then again, how do we judge reliablity?

 

[turbonutter69]

Yes they are as a rule but myself and my local Ford dealership think it was made on a Friday afternoon.

 

[T9 man]

Yes they are as a rule but myself and my local Ford dealership think it was made on a Friday afternoon.

Don't forget the Monday morning option as well

 

[jarrus]

lol, like I said there are always bad ones. You just have to take everything that people say with a pinch of salt. Drive the cars pick the one is best for you simple. Just cause I don't like VW's and Audi's doesn't mean they aren't to your liking.

 

[turbonutter69]

Could be T9.


But anyway for the record it has never broke down. It's just little issues that are annoying.

 

[HDi fun]

@TN, seriously? I thought the focus was a very reliable car.

@P, In a way I can believe it. The E39 on the whole was a reliable car, then I again I should say so at the price it was when it was new. The E36's and the E46's not so much but then again, how do we judge reliablity?

Judging reliability is very hard to do objectively - based upon your points exactly. Owner's perceptions can often be misleading, such as in my Dad's case with his money burning Astra which cost £1400 quid over the last twelve months in repairs alone over and above servicing and wear and tear items such as pads, discs and tyres.!

That's why owners opinions are unreliable in general.

There are always rogue cars, thankfully not many now to be honest.

My E39 is getting on in years but it was a one owner with fully documented BMW history (I have all the invoices as well as the service book) which does help to give a buyer confidence.

The original buy price (I have the invoice from Cooper BMW, Ipswich) was just short of £41,000 in total (includes all options and first reg fee etc etc) so in fairness it should be a decent car.

Yet, had it been neglected then it would be a dog now. In fairness it's not had much in the way of remedial work done at all, mostly just timely servicing which in no small way goes to show the long term economic benefits of maintenance and servicing.

 

[Yugguy]

Aye, people who "save money" by not servicing are basically a bit stupid.

 

[bigbadjoe]

Aye, people who "save money" by not servicing are basically a bit stupid.

My old man annoyes me about that. For the last 4 years or so, he has gone through about 10 cars by hoping they pass there mot, and if they fail and will cost big bucks to fix will scrap and buy another banger.
I tried explaining to him, that if he just spent £100 a year or so, then this problem would not happen.

Annoyes me, because he has scrapped some good motors.

 

[HDi fun]

The antithesis of my Dad then.