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Old 25-08-2010, 04:03 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Wink Peugeot 307 hdi remap?

I recently bought an 03' pug 307 1.4hdi as my first car (for cheap insurance obviously). A remapping company nearby have mapped one of them before from 70bhp stand to 96bhp+.

So is it worth it to increase its power at least a bit?lol

And also what exhaust system would you recommend?

Cheers
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Old 25-08-2010, 04:33 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: Peugeot 307 hdi remap?

Leave the exhaust as standard. Same with air filter. Diesels breathe pretty well anyway. You should see about 95-100bhp and easily over 150lbft torque. Well worth having. Does your car have an intercooler?
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Old 25-08-2010, 10:05 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: Peugeot 307 hdi remap?

Quote:
Originally Posted by HDi fun View Post
Leave the exhaust as standard. Same with air filter. Diesels breathe pretty well anyway. You should see about 95-100bhp and easily over 150lbft torque. Well worth having. Does your car have an intercooler?
No it doesnt have an intercooler. what do you recommend?
cheers
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Old 25-08-2010, 10:48 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: Peugeot 307 hdi remap?

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Originally Posted by rd070707 View Post
No it doesnt have an intercooler. what do you recommend?
cheers
Firstly, check whether or not an intercooler can be easily fitted. I imagine that it would be possible with only a small amount of extra 'plumbing'. I'm not a mechanic so I cannot advise directly but retro-fitting one is not big deal. You're only dealing with space under the bonnet and the higher spec HDi 307s will have them without doubt.

It's worth contacting your chosen tuning specialist as well and asking the question. Many are very well versed with such information.

An intercooler alone will not score you much torque at all (and therefore not much power) but fitted before a remap can make a starting difference when the ECU code is re-written.

Celtic Tuning has a superb reputation and I have personal experience of their work, for which I can vouch unequivocally.

An intercooler is pretty much part and parcel of a turbocharged engine, whether petrol or diesel, aero or marine etc etc.

The 1.4HDi you have is basically setup to provide outstanding fuel economy figures yet offer a reasonably pleasant drive.

I'd recommend fitting an intercooler and then engaging a good tuner to remap the ECU control code. Do tell them that it has a retrofit intercooler - it leaves them much more flexibility with boost pressure limits etc.

Even with a remap I doubt you'll burn any more diesel. It's more than likely that you'll burn less!!

After a good remap you will find your engine much much smoother at all revs - a good tuner will smooth out the torque delivery firstly and only when that's in order will they start to sympathetically increase fuelling and boost pressure in equal order.

It's a complex process, but even some of the 'off-the-shelf' remaps can be very good indeed.

Do make certain that they don't just reflash the whole ECU; you don't want car specific code overwritten with generic code. This could lead to problems should the car be stolen etc.

Even with a 'generic' map you only want the portion of the code replaced which controls the engine parameters, not everything else as well.

So, in my opinion, proceed confidently but do check your sources of information.


Kind regards,

Paul.
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Old 26-08-2010, 08:52 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: Peugeot 307 hdi remap?

Quote:
Originally Posted by HDi fun View Post
Firstly, check whether or not an intercooler can be easily fitted. I imagine that it would be possible with only a small amount of extra 'plumbing'. I'm not a mechanic so I cannot advise directly but retro-fitting one is not big deal. You're only dealing with space under the bonnet and the higher spec HDi 307s will have them without doubt.

It's worth contacting your chosen tuning specialist as well and asking the question. Many are very well versed with such information.

An intercooler alone will not score you much torque at all (and therefore not much power) but fitted before a remap can make a starting difference when the ECU code is re-written.

Celtic Tuning has a superb reputation and I have personal experience of their work, for which I can vouch unequivocally.

An intercooler is pretty much part and parcel of a turbocharged engine, whether petrol or diesel, aero or marine etc etc.

The 1.4HDi you have is basically setup to provide outstanding fuel economy figures yet offer a reasonably pleasant drive.

I'd recommend fitting an intercooler and then engaging a good tuner to remap the ECU control code. Do tell them that it has a retrofit intercooler - it leaves them much more flexibility with boost pressure limits etc.

Even with a remap I doubt you'll burn any more diesel. It's more than likely that you'll burn less!!

After a good remap you will find your engine much much smoother at all revs - a good tuner will smooth out the torque delivery firstly and only when that's in order will they start to sympathetically increase fuelling and boost pressure in equal order.

It's a complex process, but even some of the 'off-the-shelf' remaps can be very good indeed.

Do make certain that they don't just reflash the whole ECU; you don't want car specific code overwritten with generic code. This could lead to problems should the car be stolen etc.

Even with a 'generic' map you only want the portion of the code replaced which controls the engine parameters, not everything else as well.

So, in my opinion, proceed confidently but do check your sources of information.


Kind regards,

Paul.
Wow great reply Hdifun
and if i increase the bhp to near 100 can i expect tp have to upgrade clutch etc?
thanks for all your help

Last edited by rd070707; 26-08-2010 at 08:55 AM. Reason: added question
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Old 26-08-2010, 09:33 AM   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: Peugeot 307 hdi remap?

Quote:
Originally Posted by rd070707 View Post
Wow great reply Hdifun
and if i increase the bhp to near 100 can i expect tp have to upgrade clutch etc?
thanks for all your help
I doubt it. It's torque (twisting force) that will hammer a clutch rather than bhp itself. If it starts to slip under acceleration then get an uprated one fitted at that point.

I ran my 2.2 HDi rempped to 192bhp and a massive 320lbft (for reference that's more than a 4.0 litre Jaguar XK8) on a standard clutch with no problems. I did end up having the clutch replaced at about 107,000 miles (remap was done at 50,000) and replaced like for like.

The problem with that car was wheelspin. In THIRD !!
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Old 26-08-2010, 09:53 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: Peugeot 307 hdi remap?

Quote:
Originally Posted by HDi fun View Post
I doubt it. It's torque (twisting force) that will hammer a clutch rather than bhp itself. If it starts to slip under acceleration then get an uprated one fitted at that point.

I ran my 2.2 HDi rempped to 192bhp and a massive 320lbft (for reference that's more than a 4.0 litre Jaguar XK8) on a standard clutch with no problems. I did end up having the clutch replaced at about 107,000 miles (remap was done at 50,000) and replaced like for like.

The problem with that car was wheelspin. In THIRD !!
Cool thanks for the help. What recommendations would you have for an intercooler as i dont know much about them?
cheers
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Old 26-08-2010, 10:55 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: Peugeot 307 hdi remap?

Quote:
Originally Posted by rd070707 View Post
Cool thanks for the help. What recommendations would you have for an intercooler as i dont know much about them?
cheers
Nor do I to be honest but the simplest route would probably be to use the same one as the 1.6HDi 110bhp engine.
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Old 26-08-2010, 11:20 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: Peugeot 307 hdi remap?

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Originally Posted by HDi fun View Post
Nor do I to be honest but the simplest route would probably be to use the same one as the 1.6HDi 110bhp engine.
Will look it up. Thanks again
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Old 26-08-2010, 07:59 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: Peugeot 307 hdi remap?

I would say the exhaust system is worth a look into as well, diesel aren't as equal as others, I do find that the exhaust on my 306 turbo diesel very restrictive, but do be careful as too large will hamper performance where you need it, as for the intake I suggest just having a look over it for any obvious restrictions in the pipe work and deal with it accordingly, as for panel filters I wouldn't bother as they really won't gain you much and must likely nothing at all, (the filter it's self will more than likely be the least restrictive part believe it or not) but an intercooler from the 1.6 hdi or the 2.0 hdi even should fit onto the car fairly easy but I dare say you will need to arrange the pipework yourself
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Old 26-08-2010, 08:35 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Default Re: Peugeot 307 hdi remap?

I'll take that at face value and thanks for raising this point. In my experience modern diesels have very pretty freely flowing exhausts. The problem with the 307 we're discussing is that in all likelyhood it has a DPF.

This will be the most restrictive exhaust component, apart from the turbocharger itself.

Turbo diesel engines do not make significant use of exhaust scavenging to create partial vacuum in the intake part of the cycle. There's no real need anyway because there's no throttle on a diesel engine so it's alway breathing unimpeded atmospheric air at worst. Once the supercharger gets into its stride the air is rammed in by that very effectively.

There will be room for improvement but when you consider that a modern diesel engine does its best work between about 1500rpm and 4500rpm at best the need for massive valve overlap is not there. Nothing is opening and closing fast enough for the opening/closing periods to really impede gas flow.

As for panel filter replacements i totally agree with Jarrus. I can't see the need. OEM filters are dead cheap. Cheap enough to replace every couple of months if necessary and a lot less fagging around with the cleaning/oiling process required of a supposedly high performance alternative.
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Old 26-08-2010, 10:12 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Default Re: Peugeot 307 hdi remap?

Yes it will have a dpf, which I would remove, I would say a freer flowing exhaust is only really needed after any performance upgrade after a "stage 1" remap for example an intercooler, if you are going to be pushing more rubbish out into the exhaust the backpressure is going to be greater, which if you add an intercooler and futher the first remap then this I would look into, plus EGT's are something to consider which is why i suggested the possible need for one in the future
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Old 26-08-2010, 11:52 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Default Re: Peugeot 307 hdi remap?

You cannot just remove the DPF wantonly. The ECU will bitch incessantly if you do so.
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Old 27-08-2010, 09:44 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Default Re: Peugeot 307 hdi remap?

thanks for the input guys . So if i am definately installing an intercooler and getting it remapped, what exhaust system if any would you recommend?
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Old 27-08-2010, 09:57 AM   #15 (permalink)
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Default Re: Peugeot 307 hdi remap?

I have found a 2nd hand intercooler that came out of a 03' 2.0 hdi for 40. Seems like a good price? how about fitting it? would any mechanic be able to do it?
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Old 27-08-2010, 10:36 AM   #16 (permalink)
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Default Re: Peugeot 307 hdi remap?

Price is fine. We'll have to assume it doesn't have leaks. If you can get hold of some paraffin it's worthwhile cleaning out the intercooler.

Fitting should be possible by anyone familiar with Peugeots. Don't know where you are but Pug1Off in Brackley (01280 701919) will do it for you. Matt Jobling is the man to speak with.
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Old 27-08-2010, 10:58 AM   #17 (permalink)
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Default Re: Peugeot 307 hdi remap?

Quote:
Originally Posted by HDi fun View Post
Price is fine. We'll have to assume it doesn't have leaks. If you can get hold of some paraffin it's worthwhile cleaning out the intercooler.

Fitting should be possible by anyone familiar with Peugeots. Don't know where you are but Pug1Off in Brackley (01280 701919) will do it for you. Matt Jobling is the man to speak with.
no im in norther ireland but i will check out any locals who are used to peugeots. Will the 2.0 hdi intercooler fit the same as the 1.6 hdi?
Also the company I was looking at to do the remap was auto-tune in NI. There website is www.auto-tune.co.uk .
What should I tell them I want considering I do not want any problems down the line by overdoing it.
Cheers again
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Old 27-08-2010, 11:32 AM   #18 (permalink)
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Default Re: Peugeot 307 hdi remap?

here is a pic of the 2.0 hdi intercooler
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Old 27-08-2010, 11:45 AM   #19 (permalink)
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Default Re: Peugeot 307 hdi remap?

should be big enough for what you need,
and i do know that the dpf will need mapping out, custom exhaust will be the best option i reckon, you will find it to be around the same price as an off the shelf exhaust and the exhaust centre will be able to advise you on the correct size to go for, probebly 2" will be enough
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Old 27-08-2010, 11:55 AM   #20 (permalink)
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Default Re: Peugeot 307 hdi remap?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jarrus View Post
should be big enough for what you need,
and i do know that the dpf will need mapping out, custom exhaust will be the best option i reckon, you will find it to be around the same price as an off the shelf exhaust and the exhaust centre will be able to advise you on the correct size to go for, probebly 2" will be enough
Sorry for being a real noob but when you say custom exhaust, do you mean just a back box or a whole new exhaust or what? this is my first car so im pretty new to everything mechanical.lol
I know what a DPF is but what do you mean it will need mapping out?
Cheers again
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Old 27-08-2010, 12:38 PM   #21 (permalink)
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Default Re: Peugeot 307 hdi remap?

bump
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Old 27-08-2010, 12:59 PM   #22 (permalink)
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Default Re: Peugeot 307 hdi remap?

Leave the DPF in place.
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Old 27-08-2010, 05:52 PM   #23 (permalink)
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Default Re: Peugeot 307 hdi remap?

You would leave it in place p?
Why? you of all people know they are a pig to maintain, and besides a good mapper will be able to map it out,

and when I say map it out rd, I mean they will physically remove it then will search for the code in the ecu that will put it in limp home mode and alter it so it won't look for it,

as for custom exhaust I mean the whole system, cat back or possibly turbo back if emissions tests will allow, but don't good too loud
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Old 27-08-2010, 06:13 PM   #24 (permalink)
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Default Re: Peugeot 307 hdi remap?

yea I dont want it to loud. So what is the benefit of mapping out the DPF?
Also where would you recommend to get a custom exhaust systemmade?
Cheers
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Old 27-08-2010, 07:35 PM   #25 (permalink)
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Default Re: Peugeot 307 hdi remap?

They can be problematic if your driving style is very very sedate but I had no problems with mine apart from the additive replenishment, which can cost 60-70 quid a go. Yours might be different, however. Later ones are sometimes maintenance free.

If you can get it mapped out then you must remove it otherwise it will clog. This is the ideal situation, I agree with you. You will get better gasflow without it.

If you can't get it mapped out then leave it there otherwise the ECU will start logging fault codes.

If it's mapped out and removed you can get away with slightly less exotic engine oil as well. You should still use fully synthetic oil but you don't have to specify (and pay for) a low sufated ash formulation.
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